Theory about friends during depression

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Hargan
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Theory about friends during depression

#1

Post by Hargan »

So today I had an interesting epiphany. This bout of depression I've been stuck in hasn't lifted since my dad died and has gotten so ingrained in me, that I've become able to work well with it going. And I don't want to hear anyone talk about how they're here for me. Because, and this is a fascinating discovery I learned today: You're not.

Now that I have you pretty angry and pissed off, allow me to explain. Friends during your depression will try to help you out. Why? Sure, they might care, they might prefer to see you happy, but a lot of it seems to stem from a positive bias. The act of helping someone else is a positive feel good bias: You did well by helping the person out, and you feel good. But these people, with little to no training in psychology, will attempt to lecture about how they're there for the person, and then wedge themselves in to try help the person out. A noble ideal and one that is purely self-serving, with the goal of feeling good about helping out a friend and restoring them back to a happier mood when in fact, more often than not, their actions can end up aggravating or even pushing the person affected by depression further away.

Take my situation for example: When depressed, people keep telling me how I have so many people around who care about me. Yet, when I'm depressed, I feel people shouldn't care about me. So telling me there are more, means I am failing, and thus I am forced into a position wherein I must push people away to protect them, to prove I am a problem. But they will stay there, saying just how many people I have infected by my presence. Great job. This has infuriated me to the point that I have started becoming hermetic, just to get away from the idiots who don't understand they shouldn't be doing that.

So, here is my theory about friends: They try to do good, but in the end, end up causing so much harm and damage, that they mess up the person even more. Now, I don't have enough proof yet, my sample size is 1 with only experiential proof, but I firmly believe, that unless people are trained in how to help people with depression, they really shouldn't try.

I'd love to hear others' opinions and stories about how people close to them have affected their term of depression and/ or other mental problems too. I mean, if we can find further evidence of this afield, we might find an interesting niche in which people should be taught how to deal with, or learn to leave the situation alone.
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Re: Theory about friends during depression

#2

Post by Sa1tflat »

I agree with you. I wish that this would be taught in schools. As far as I have got this is not mentioned. I am in grade 10 BTW. Jet you can't be left alone to suffer on your own. But others "helping" you is not a answer. So how do you get children aged 13+ to understand the problem. The problem being that they "help" you but unknowingly to make themselves feel better. My problem being unknowingly. And I am sure that I have done the same thing to my friends. So what is the sulution?
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Re: Theory about friends during depression

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Post by Sev »

Having become accustomed to self-inflicted misery, I do not agree with you at all.

The worst thing that I can do during one of my depressive episodes is withdraw from everything.
My closest friends are capable of lifting my mood, no matter how badly things are going.

Leeward, Galahad, and my one old school friend being chiefly among them.
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Re: Theory about friends during depression

#4

Post by Sa1tflat »

See this is what makes physiology so interesting. Sev has an different view of the matter and thus I will change my statement to. In school more of the physiological stuff should be focused on not just 1 or 2 pages. As we all are different mentally and physically this is an hard subject to agree apon.

Any other view of the theory? This is a very interesting topic. I would like to see how this plays out. Let's just keep it civil this has a potential to get insulting.

That's all folks...
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Re: Theory about friends during depression

#5

Post by Sev »

You're not Leeward in disguise, are you?

She said exactly the same thing.
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Re: Theory about friends during depression

#6

Post by Animew »

Hargan wrote: And I don't want to hear anyone talk about how they're here for me. Because, and this is a fascinating discovery I learned today: You're not.
lol, oh don’t be so fucking emo. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ trying to console people when they bitch about how sad and depressed they are is just what we do automatically... you know, so we seem like decent human beings and all.

sure you get those bleeding heart types that try to appear all saintly by "helping" folks with their charity and junk (often making it worse in making people dependent and or lazy) but the great majority of people say they are there for you out of either politeness or genuine empathy.

you see, here’s the really "fascinating discovery": no one has the time to deal with your problems for you and no one should have to, so that feeling of disappointment and or disgust you feel when people give you half assed words of comfort is completely unwarranted and you may have fallen victim to the pity payroll. (you expect pity almost like people owe it to you as a result of people consistently giving you it.)

oh, and along with those nasty "
Hargan wrote:idiots who don't understand they shouldn't be doing that
you also get those people who try to "help" because of some superiority complex. they think their advice and solutions to your problems are superior to yours and that you are incapable of dealing with your own situation... <w< i think we all know a few of those.
Hargan wrote:when I'm depressed, I feel people shouldn't care about me. So telling me there are more, means I am failing, and thus I am forced into a position wherein I must push people away to protect them, to prove I am a problem. But they will stay there, saying just how many people I have infected by my presence.
(.>ヮ<.) nyahaha! really? REALLY? "infected by my presence"!? wow! forgive me if i come across as a completely insensitive asshole but that there is some A+ grade emo bullshit, especially designed to make folks go "daw, don’t beat yourself up! we really DO care! *sympathy intensifies*"
seems more a case of you feel really down and you want comfort but you are not getting it from the so called friends with their "we're here for you" shpeal... so you say things like this in an attempt to make them try harder.

...but yea, im afraid that no matter what kind of misery befalls you... it’s no one’s job to comfort you through it and you can’t blame folks for not "helping" you properly and merely giving you the standard greeting card grade lines.

(/<w<)/ Here’s my bit of untrained armchair psychology nonsense:
let it go. if you keep clinging to the stuff that makes you feel sad you won’t ever stop being sad no matter what other people do to comfort you(duh).
we often feel obligated to cling to the sadness of a loved one passed because we feel we owe them that grief (you know, like if you are not sad because they died you didn’t love them as much) but IMO you owe them the opposite, let their mortality be a reminder of your own and spur you on to enjoy the life you have left in respect to their memory.
Sa1tflat wrote:I would like to see how this plays out.
(OwO)/ hehe, you must be new here right?
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Re: Theory about friends during depression

#7

Post by jacojerb »

In my personal experiences with depression, friends definitely do help. Except there's no way I'd let them know I'm feeling depressed

This probably isn't the healthiest way to deal with it. But if you just pretend things are okay, sometimes, for a few hours at least, things might actually feel okay

I know it might be hard to not just outright avoid friends. Depression really is a bitch like that... The things you need most are the things that feel hardest to do

Also, yeah. If you do let friends know you're feeling depressed and they try to help you, sure, some, or maybe even most, might be in it for themselves, or because its what's socially expected of them. This does make the help feel fake... But know that a good friend really does care about your well being. Not just any old friend, talk to someone you know you can trust more than anything

Once again, I'm no expert. I'm still more or less dealing with stuff. I've been getting a lot better, but that's due to moving to another country with my boyfriend and all... A change of scenery always helps a lot.
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Re: Theory about friends during depression

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Post by Hargan »

Animew wrote: (/<w<)/ Here’s my bit of untrained armchair psychology nonsense:
let it go. if you keep clinging to the stuff that makes you feel sad you won’t ever stop being sad no matter what other people do to comfort you(duh).
As that part is the only part I actually feel like responding to directly beside what I will do next, I just want to point out that letting go of the fact that you can't find work is.... unwise. I mean, sure, I could just get up, go and live as a hobo, but frankly, not what I want to do. And yes, 90% of my depression stems from a lack of a job.

As for the rest of your response: You honestly think I'm trying to go for self-pity? Wow.... okay, maybe that explains why people act the way they do. Thanks. Side note: The total number of people I have removed from my life in depression has now accumulated over the years to about 120. This is because I hate myself with such a passion that I push people away from me. That isn't a cry for help, that's a warning bell. So maybe I finally understand: people think I'm trying to get attention when I say to stay away from me, but in fact, they think I just want attention.

So then, to rectify this problem, would it be better to:
a- Tell people I will abuse the stuff about their own fears and problems they told me confidentiality in order to force them to leave me alone, or
b- Just continue doing it until people leave me alone?

And yes, I did tell my one ex that every time I said I loved him, it was all a lie, just to have him leave me alone. I'm that kind of messed up, not your average: Awwwr, he's asking for help. I'm the kind that will drag you down into the depths of anger and sadness in order to get some sick sadistic twisted pleasure out of seeing you suffer as I am suffering.

But again, thanks for pointing out what others see. It makes a lot of sense.

Also, I am toying with telling a person who constantly bugs me and tries to make me feel better that they were the reason a person they knew at school went home and comitted suicide, especially since they were one of the last few people to interact with them. This is the level of sadistic streak you are dealing with.
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Re: Theory about friends during depression

#9

Post by Animew »

Hargan wrote: I'm the kind that will drag you down into the depths of anger and sadness in order to get some sick sadistic twisted pleasure out of seeing you suffer as I am suffering.
so... what you are really saying is, that you are in fact a huge asshole? (OwO)\ i guess I’m down with that, i'm a pretty huge asshole myself. i for one actively try to be decent human being tho but embracing the fact that you're an asshole is something i can respect. but perhaps that may be why you hate yourself since we tend to automatically hate people who are assholes?

it’s because of the side effects of assholism that i think it’s important to try to be a better person, or at least adhere to some code of conduct that you can justify to yourself. again you would be doing this not for other people but for yourself... Owo you know, because self hatred leads to a self destructive lifestyle and those can be uncomfortable to live.
Hargan wrote:I mean, sure, I could just get up, go and live as a hobo, but frankly, not what I want to do. And yes, 90% of my depression stems from a lack of a job.
(/<w<)/ hehe, so you are like the 30 year old man living in his parents basement? that explains a lot actually... but yea your depression is probably more a result of your environment/lifestyle than the physical factor of not having employment... trust me, you gon be just as miserable with a job... probably even more so and you know it (Owo)\ it probably makes you even more depressed. now i don’t know your situation and i don’t know you but i think it’s safe to say you need to find something you like doing and come up with a way to make it economically feasible... since the obvious downside of unemployment is the lack of money... the other downside is feeling like a worthless leach living off other people... you'd need your own place to solve that i recon but for most folks being financially independent is enough.
Hargan wrote:So maybe I finally understand: people think I'm trying to get attention when I say to stay away from me,
nah, i'd say it’s more these kinda bits right here:
Hargan wrote:Side note: The total number of people I have removed from my life in depression has now accumulated over the years to about 120. This is because I hate myself with such a passion that I push people away from me.
mentioning self deprecating stuff and denoting it as a "side note" does not indicate genuine self distain as much as it indicates the need to come across as self loathing. the only obvious reason to come across as self loathing is to illicit sympathy. kinda like beating yourself up in front of people to artificially identify yourself as a victim in their eyes.
*sigh* believe me, the subtleties of communication is a real pain in the ass. so yea man, if you keep going about it like you do all you’re doing is painting a big "help me please" on your face... i could give more examples but i'm hoping you get the picture.
i'm not saying you are just looking for attention but folks that genuinely want to be left alone to wallow in their misery tend to pretend everything is fine.
Hargan wrote:So then, to rectify this problem, would it be better to:
a- Tell people I will abuse the stuff about their own fears and problems they told me confidentiality in order to force them to leave me alone, or
b- Just continue doing it until people leave me alone?
none of the above. i'd recommend confronting the people in question with the biggest SE-grin you can manage and thanking them for all they have done for you so far. tell them how you've recently met someone online that you really like and you are fostering a romantic relationship with this person. mention how you are feeling loads better now and pretend to be happy.
then decrease the amount of contact you have with them to the point where you stop entirely.
and there you go... tell folks you're fine and tell them like you mean it, then they will stop trying to make you feel better. of course there is the chance that you are just a crappy liar, and they keep insisting that there is something wrong with you but then you just do the Ricky Ricardo tried and tested "this ain’t about me it’s about you" and tell them that they are starting to freak you out and ask them if THEY are feeling all rite because you are getting clingy vibes from them.
Hargan wrote:But again, thanks for pointing out what others see. It makes a lot of sense.
(Ow<)/ no problem. I’m a loud mouthed know it all, calling attention to stuff i feel people are doing wrong is what i love doing.
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Re: Theory about friends during depression

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Post by Hargan »

Animew wrote: i'm not saying you are just looking for attention but folks that genuinely want to be left alone to wallow in their misery tend to pretend everything is fine.
You know, I was able to do that for a long time. Looks like it's time to crack open that barrel again.

Thanks

Edit: If this quote doesn't work, don't care, tried to set up up 5 times now
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Re: Theory about friends during depression

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Post by Splicer-Fox »

Is this not a hikikomori thing?
I always believed that South Africa was ripe for the epidemic.

The cultural dissidence.
The quality of your job/life correlating to what education you can afford.
Then an addiction to digital media to help cope with the situation.

We will have our own suicide forest next.
Or if we are more like America the blades and guns will be used on people and schools.

And everybody will be blaming anything they can for the phenomenon.
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